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This entry was edited (1 year ago)
I get the desire for them but in my experience the negative side has been much worse than the positive side. Quoting out of context to inflame followers is an easy way to gain notoriety. And replying directly to a post takes more guts than those craven simps usually have. I prefer boosting a post I find noteworthy and adding a reply if I think I have something to say to my followers. Boosting doesn’t mean I agree, it means I think it’s worth discussing
I can understand the intuition that others will abuse the tool, but I do not think the risks are unique to QB and avoiding rich support for links within mastodon really just makes the moderators job harder. The bad actors you’re describing there will still do a “QB” but it will be much harder for mods to enforce policy against them.
one thing I find perplexing is the presence of both these responses:
1 quote boosts lead to abuse
2 a boosted reply is equivalent to a quote boost

What stops someone from replying with a dunk, and then boosting it and the original post, for their followers to pile on? Because that happens now, and is more costly to moderate.
"Craven simps too cowardly to reply" doesn't hold water. Trolls *usually* reply, that's how it works.
The only thing I can think of is context: “Look at this [insult]” works differently when you can see it. Having to click through and scroll back takes more effort, and dims the outrage a little. I think there’s some truth in that, especially since Mastodon is always a little slow, but probably less than people think (assuming that’s what they’re thinking)
I was thinking about the merits of the opposite extreme. A system without any boosts. The only option is a quote-boost or a reply. In other words *add something* to the discussion, don't just passively re-share or like.

In examining why I care about this issue so much, I think one of the more personal reasons is due to finding much more value in replies & being quoted with a reply than in likes or boosts.

What we have here is a system that needs boosts to work and blocks quotes.
This entry was edited (1 year ago)
Here is the thing: if everyone who wanted quote-posts moved to an instance who supported them (hint: there are literally hundreds, if not thousands, of them), they could have what they want and still be able to interact with Mastodon servers. Furthermore, if they went away from Mastodon en masse to Misskey or Pleroma, and Mastodon was reduced to a minority actor in the Fediverse, it would have to adopt the new standard.

So, let’s see whether those master ‘organisers’ decide to move their asses and get what they’re asking for.

@iramjohn
People won't need to move, the changes will come when some servers decide to simply update with forks that support the feature.
Incrementalism FTW!

Listen, those who want that feature can’t code, and those who can, either don’t want that feature, or already have it implemented, but not on Mastodon or any of its forks. If you’re willing to live with the status quo, that’s alright with me. I do have quote posts on this instance, but, with all due respect, your stance is simply ineffective.
You don't need to know how to code to ask your admin to consider updating to the #hometown fork of Mastodon on the next server upgrade.

Anyone can do that.

Though, given that most of the forks of Mastodon are implementing QT I don't think it's true that "those who want that feature can’t code" Just something you see to be assuming for some reason.
Yes, anyone can ask. Meanwhile, those who can actually do stuff remain the gatekeepers of what actually gets done.

Good luck convincing admins of installing a new tool because some people who couldn’t be bothered to do it themselves want some feature that the whole Fediverse is divided about and has barely been used for years even where it is available. Also good luck convincing Mastodon developers of supporting at least showing those quote-posts as they’re meant to appear instead of just as links. Finally, good luck convincing moderators of working much more for free.

I already gave you a solution, but as a really wise man said, YDHTTMWFI.
maybe we shouldn't support hopeful feature implementation on Mastodon or their forks. the original brand is quite posessive of the image and functionality of Mastodon to the point of expecting their users to not discover Misskey or Pleroma, and anything implemented elsewhere they will actively seek to silence by making the post make no sense due to feature disparity. it does not fail gracefully, it saves face.

we just have to get used to what the brand wants or expect dissenting users to change to another implementation altogether.

(mastodon reads like a brand to me at this point. that is not good for any FOSS code.)
I've encountered this kind of pessimism before about Mastodon (kept me from supporting their patreon for a long time.) They recently posted a roadmap; that has given me hope they will focus on ... growing not dominating.

It's tempting to buy-in to the idea that ugly way QTs from other services look on mastodon servers is a conspiracy-- but I don't want to totally jump to that conclusion.

It's better for all of us if this can be ... cooperative.

https://joinmastodon.org/roadmap
QT on Misskey appear as both a reply and an individual post. What would be the negative there? It's purely cosmetic.

And Mastodon kinda does have the image that the devs do what they want as they might be on a power trip. There's no reason whatsoever to not have implemented Misskey's QTs yet, or custom emoji reactions. Indeed, they haven't even implemented unicode emoji reactions.

They haven't implemented five-option polls. They haven't implemented support for more than four images. They want to baby their userbase like GNOME does their desktop environment's users by removing anything that a human could find confusing; however they try to make it into a perfect work of art instead, because they don't actually care about implementing features or perfecting the user experience.

And I don't care much for Mastodon's success either, because of "The Mastodon Network" being a thing at all. And I will not use expletives here but I really would like to, because they're being really hostile to basically anyone who doesn't run mainstream official Mastodon code.

It's not pessimism. It's hatred.
How have they been hostile? Can you explain a little more?

(NOT doubting you at all. I just have not been around here for years and don't know the history. I was shocked to see that features and issues that I was raising as if new have languished in the discussion and known bugs sections of github for years. I am "Concerned" and remain "Concerned" -- )

How did it go down? Tell me more.
Sounds like open source is doing it's thing. I don't know anything about this Eugen, but if he wants to run things as a benevolent dictator for life (hourly more benevolent than Torvalds (love hearing the man's thoughts but his behaviour as BD4L is hard to justify 3 decades), while others can fork it and create the vertical microblogging change they want to see in the world, then great. Many of the forks are interoperable, if I'm not mistaken, so why not?
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